Talk:Ace Attorney Wiki

This talk page is currently being used as the main page for discussing improvements on the wiki in general as well as the main page. If and when this page grows, it may have to be archived and general wiki discussions done on the forums.''

Hey, guys!
So I noticed that there was no talk page on the main page, so here it is. I just thought that a few of the more nitpicky subjects like spoiler policies, how to get more users in, how to interpret certain weird plot inconsistencies, etc. could be discussed here. This page could also be a place to bring specific issues up like orphaned pages and such.

I think that right now some of the biggest issues include orphaned pages like State VS Enigmar (perhaps it should be merged into Turnabout Succession? The case is actually playable, unlike the DL-6 Incident and the SL-9 Incident) as well as how to handle spoiler material and what to do with the age contradictions. -capefeather 18:03, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Contributors
I'll try and add a few more case summaries this week, possibly for the longer cases but I've noticed that there seems to be a severe lack of contributors in general, besides those who perform the minor edits. Is there any particular reason for this? Surely there must be a lot of Ace Attorney fans out there? ;/ -Premonition 14:52, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Two words: Court Records. But seriously, I don't think I could invest the time to make a complete episode page practically from scratch, myself. -capefeather 23:43, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * While I admire and respect Court Records it's by no means a comprehensive wiki as this has the potential to be. I do agree that taking the effort to write episode summaries from scratch can be quite time consuming, although I strangely enjoy the satisfaction when it's completed lol. -Premonition 05:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That may be, but the sheer popularity of the site probably draws people away from other fan projects like this wiki. It looks like Wikipedia and GameFAQs/GameSpot are the only sites that even link to this place. -capefeather 17:50, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Main Page design
I did a little redesign of the Main Page yesterday, but I'm kind of at a loss as to where to go with this. I basically moved most of the "important" information from the upper-left box to the top to make it more prominent (as text already existed at the top). I felt that it was kind of redundant to put "Ace Attorney Wiki" in two places on the Main Page. But now I'm still uneasy about it... I wonder whether Template:Current events should be squeezed into a third column (like the Final Fantasy Wiki, or whether I should just leave it where it is (like the StarCraft Wiki. Maybe I should put in more pictures/buttons or something. I'm just not sure. capefeather 00:03, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The new look is good, though I'm afraid the brown color isn't my style haha. The Template:Current events looks fine the way it is in my view but some more pictures would always be welcome I guess. Not quite sure what you mean by buttons though. I do have a question actually; how often does the random quote on the main page change? -Premonition 12:23, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I was going for a courtroom-style look :( I guess I was influenced by the colours of the benches and the buttons that appear in the games. The skin also had yellow, the other prominent colour in the courtroom. It seemed appropriate. The default skin selection is pretty limited, and I barely know any CSS, so yeah. Do you have a suggestion for a better skin? As for the random quote thing, I'm not really sure myself. Maybe it picks one every time you bypass your cache. capefeather 21:49, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I guess Sapphire would be good for representing Wright & Co. Law Offices, as his books are all blue. Or Jade might represent Charley. I guess I could go back to Sapphire for now. capefeather 22:02, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I like the sapphire skin to be honest, it looks more clean and easy on the eye. The brown color looked kinda.....unpleasant? That's only my own opinion though, I'm quite sure there's probably others who liked it. Although I do understand the color choice now that you mentioned the courtroom style look. - Premonition 13:22, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Sprites?
I noticed that some of the character pages don't have their sprites :\ I think the sprites should be on there. I mean, sure, we'ed ether have to get them off somewhere like Court-Records or something, or rip them ourselves, but the Articles do look a little bare without them. It seems a little stupid not to have them. Takoto 14:09, 27 November 2008 (UTC)


 * We usually try and get offical art/good fan art for the character page. If we can't find that we use the sprites Ruan 9:48 27 Novemer 2008 (GMT)


 * I know that, but still, the articles should contain their sprites. This is a Wiki, and Wiki's normally try to get every piece of information about a certain subject. Leaving out the sprites when you could easily get them is stupid. You could just make a small section of the bottom and put their sprites there. Look at the Pokémon Wiki, Bulbapedia, they use the official artwork, and also have the sprites. Takoto 18:35, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
 * If you mean Cody Hackins and Joe Darke (I don't think I've missed any others), I just never got around to it. Sorry :( Yeah. Basically, it seems like the Gyakuten Kenji official art takes priority, followed by original official art and sprites, or sprites could replace official art if it's in a magazine with other weird drawings and stuff and isn't really fit to be the main portrait. At least, that's what I think was the case before I got here. capefeather 23:08, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, if you mean character pages with OAs but no sprites, I suppose we ought to put them in, but most of the character articles aren't complete in the first place, which kind of limits good places to put the sprite images. capefeather 23:10, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Look, what I mean is keep the Official Artwork, but make something at the bottom or something for the sprites to go in. Like I said earlier, "This is a Wiki, and Wiki's normally try to get every piece of information about a certain subject. Leaving out the sprites when you could easily get them is stupid". Does anyone here even understand what I'm suggesting. Takoto 23:38, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Are you suggesting we obtain/ rip off the sprite sheets from Court Records or something? If so, I believe there are more important things to get done first. Like I dunno, actually having full case summaries for every case? I don't see a necessary reason to include spritesheets/links to sprite sheets as a priority as they're easily obtained, as you say from Court Records. But by all means, if you feel they are vastly important, do feel free to add/link to them someplace on the respective pages. This is a wiki so don't be afraid to use your initiative! - Premonition 23:55, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I also ask that you ask things more politely, as I've already answered your question. Sure, the point of this wiki is to be a comprehensive source of AA info, but right now, we're NOT a comprehensive source of AA info in the slightest, so our priorities are not on pics that much. By all means, put sprites in wherever you deem them likely (you can use to make a gallery), but I don't think that's nearly the most important thing right now. capefeather 02:31, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Ugggggh. Sorry. I really didn't mean to snap, recently i've been having... er, personality issues recently. *cough*Bipoler*cough* Takoto 16:55, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

Breakdown/Surprise
I had been browsing this site, and was curious, there is the Breakdown page, where it lists the breakdowns of different characters, and then it occurred to me, that the only characters who have Breakdowns are the suspects themselves, and the other characters have 'Surprise' moments, or Freakouts if you want to call it that, and are less severe than the Breakdowns, often just when the character gets shocked. Basically, who's in favor of creating a separate page for the shocks? Yes, I know that there are other pages in need of fixing, but this is just something that has been bugging me. --Idene 17:02, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

EDIT: OR, instead of creating a new page entirely, how about simply putting a second bullet of their shock moment? Any ideas or opinions are appreciated on this. --Idene 17:08, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Although Talk:Breakdown is probably the better place to have this conversation, I suppose a mention of it here would help. But I honestly don't know what to do with that article. When I look at it, I think of questions like: I've tried to raise the issue on the talk page and got no reply, so I don't know how successful this will be in getting people to talk about it. capefeather 20:49, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * What exactly is a breakdown?
 * Is it too vague a term to keep an article about it?
 * (As you said) Should there be separate articles for other animation categories like "surprised", etc.?
 * Is the name "breakdown" even appropriate?
 * Would video footage of the breakdowns be better?

Fan-made stuff?
As per recent edits to the main page by a new editor, do people think that this wiki should document notable fan works? If so, how are we going to go about deciding what's "notable"? I'm not sure it would be appropriate to document every fan work under the sun. capefeather 16:31, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, aren't we more of an in-universe wiki, with some out-universe elements, but sticking to non-fan made stuff? (fanbooks of the series being exempt from this) I mean, they could just use the Gyakuten Wiki for such things. To be succinct, I'm against it. --Tutuboy95 16:37, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Including fanworks is a very slippery slope - it's not relevant if it's not endorsed by Capcom or similar. Best to avoid it altogether. - NPChilla1 17:06, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, as the 'new editor' in question, my opinion on this might seem kinda biased, but fanwork-related articles should stay, just as minor articles not given as much attention as the articles for official material. - Mr. PBJ


 * Actually, you're not the new editor in question. Some dude put "The fan creations" into the Main Page one day. To the point, though, I think that you could convince people better by explaining your argument and addressing the issues Tutuboy95, NPChilla1 and I have pointed out. capefeather 18:02, 30 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I am the said "New editor", and before I made The article I did not know that Gyakuten Wiki existed. Therefore I am now against the addition of fan creations. HOWEVER, I do believe Remnants of the Past should be noted in the wiki.

Ohh! Well, I saw the Fan Creations thing on the main page, and since I was using the editor at the time, I made the AAO article. I think Fan Creations should be added, but in a minor scale (such as websites, tools, etc.), but unlike Gyakuten Wiki, not make articles on the trials themselves. - PBJ 30 August 29, 15:04 (EST)

EDIT: See? Articles such as AAO, PWLib (if it is ever made), or other websites/engines should stay. But Articles such as the 'boot to the head' thing should not be allowed.


 * To those not doing so already, please sign your posts with " ~ ". We would still have to address how we're going to go about deciding what's "notable", because this could easily become a very slippery slope as NPChilla1 mentioned. capefeather 19:28, 30 August 2009 (UTC)


 * We could just do a brief overview, like all the case makers that are critically acclaimed/most popular (such as PWLib and AAO) but not give huge lists of trials. And I don't think such a thing needs to go on the front page. While it is duly noted, it hardly is as important as "Characters" and such. --Tutuboy95 13:51, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

No deletion! PLEASE! I do like the "Boot to the head" thing, but seriously! PLEASE DO NOT DELETE THE THING! ~Darkus


 * To be fair to the Boot to the Head article, it is the very top result when searching "Phoenix Wright" on YouTube. That could count as a "notable" fan work. capefeather 14:23, December 15, 2009 (UTC)

Since there's so little to say about each fan-work, would it be easier to make a single list of all these things to save space? Otherwise we could end up with a wiki mostly filled with slashfic and all sorts of nonsense. NPChilla1 22:16, January 6, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, slashfics are a lot less prominent than a top result of a YouTube search... Also, if something were notable enough, I suspect that we'd be able to make an article long enough for it to exist by itself. capefeather 22:28, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

Hold on a second. Cannot we just use Logic for one moment? The Ace Attorney Wiki is meant for one thing, and that is studying the universe of Ace Attorney. No matter how popular, I do not see Boot to the Head as needed material, due to the fact that it has never officially appeared in any games. It may be popular, however it is NOT IMPORTANT. Hardly anything such as Characters, or Locations, correct?


 * The people on this wiki decide what the Ace Attorney Wiki is meant for, really. capefeather 00:35, February 17, 2010 (UTC)

Main Page sections
So I've rearranged the sections on the Main Page for search engine optimization purposes, but I'm not entirely sure on the placement of some things, in particular the random quote section.

I'm getting a bit suspicious of using the poll function for featuring articles. Apparently, the function is very simplistic and abusable, and people seem to keep voting for characters overwhelmingly over everything else. Additionally, I think I'm running out of articles to feature due to many articles needing serious attention, and at this point I'm afraid of featuring characters who appear in AAI.

I think I can admit at this point that I'm not very good at maintaining a general news page. Do people have suggestions for the news section, or does anyone want to help with maintaining the news section? capefeather 21:26, September 1, 2009 (UTC)


 * I like the way The Nintendo Wiki is set up. We could try and set it up in a similar way, and put the Random Quote at the top of the page, like it used to be.
 * As for the Featured Article, are there any other ways for it to be decided? Also, we could put up a "How you can help" or something of the like so some would be a little more inclined to expand articles.--Tutuboy95 23:20, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * I thought the to do list did just that. capefeather 00:21, September 17, 2009 (UTC)
 * Concerning the FA, I figured a nomination process like ones found in other wikis would be better, but it seems that's not going to be feasible considering the total lack of input. I guess a vote's fine. capefeather 00:54, September 20, 2009 (UTC)

Outside the games
So I guess the consensus is that a brief overview of fan works could/should be made? Right now I have a category:community consisting of category:Capcom and category:fandom, as well as a possible category:press events. The Main Page can be edited accordingly to actions people take on this.

Press events coverage is a bit varied in other wikis. I did some quick Google searches, and some wikis have only official press events hosted by the developer company (e.g. The StarCraft Wiki includes an article on BlizzCon and only BlizzCon), whereas others include press events held by others (e.g. The Nintendo Wiki includes the Tokyo Game Show despite Nintendo not usually even attending TGS). Still other wikis use a news namespace or something similar. I've felt for a while that this wiki also ought to have articles on press events, but maybe the Gaming Wiki's articles on e.g. TGS are sufficient? Captivate is a Capcom-run press event; perhaps it should have an article?

I don't know what exactly the relationship is between the developers and the Gyakuten Saiban Guidebooks, so I'm not sure how their existence impacts all of this or what category is right for them. capefeather 19:28, September 7, 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't know if this matters to anyone concerning this, but Tokyo Game Show articles on other Wikia are pretty mediocre at best... Additionally, there are NO Captivate articles. capefeather 19:33, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

Main Page and Evidence Items
Is it just me or is the main page a bit...(to use the technical term) wonky? The "Recently released titles" window thingie overlaps Gyakuten Saiban 5 and Gyakuten Kenji for me. Speaking of Gyakuten Kenji, why is that there? Ace Attorney Investigations already has a wee icon. I'm hesitant to modify the main page as I wasn't sure if anyone else has problems with it and I'm scared that if I start tampering with it, it might break into tiny pixel shards that could fly out of the screen and hurt someone...

I was also wondering if it would be worthwhile having a page listing the evidence items for each game, just for completion's sake. Obviously you wouldn't have an individual page for each object (except for the ones that already do). Would this be a worthwhile thing to try or is it pointless O.C.D.-ness? Strabo412 17:40, January 1, 2010 (UTC)


 * About the latter, I don't see why not. About the former, it looks fine to me, so it might be a resolution thing. Now that you mention it, though it does seem a bit redundant to have a "recently released titles" section. capefeather 18:40, January 1, 2010 (UTC)


 * Just realised that the Gyakuten Kenji "doubler" icon I was babbling about was in fact just some text about its release date and the "Wikia Gaming" icon. Whoops!  :P  Strabo412 16:16, January 3, 2010 (UTC)

Wiki Logo
The current wiki logo has rough edges and black lines just suddenly end, I know its because of the original AAI logo.

I have taken the initiative of creating one by modding the AAI logo similar to the current one but with a nicer finish though its still alittle rough.

http://i522.photobucket.com/albums/w343/KiasuKiasiMan/AAWikiLogo.png

This is my personal work. Please have a look and if its good enough use it to replace the current logo. You can also make suggestions for me to adjust the current one.KiasuKiasiMan 13:48, April 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * The logo was uploaded on 03:03, June 3, 2009. I figured that someone would notice and do something about the obvious flaws eventually. I know virtually nothing about fixing images like this, so that's why it was left like that. It's good to see that this has finally happened. capefeather 14:16, April 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * Objection! The classic style is better looking. 24.171.243.120 23:44, April 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * The image is basically the same except with the weird kinks gone. I mean, sure, the "WIKI" part is different, but I'm not entirely sure what you're complaining about. capefeather 00:58, April 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * The "Wiki" part uses a funny-looking font, it looks out of place. As you can notice, all of the game logos use formal-looking fonts, it's what people expect from AA. 24.171.243.120 01:08, April 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, thats my fault, I didn't know what font to use for the Wiki part since its very hard to alter the word Wiki based on the current Investigations part. So I attempted to use a similar one. It would be great if someone could suggest a more suitable font for the Wiki part.KiasuKiasiMan 14:17, April 3, 2010 (UTC)


 * If nothing else, the logo itself looks so much better now in general. Nice work.  Strabo412 16:12, April 3, 2010 (UTC)

Ghost Trick
Well, I've barely been following Ghost Trick: Phantom Detective at all, so I only just found out about this, which implies that there is significant crossover between GT:PD and Ace Attorney and perhaps GT even takes place in the AA universe. This considered, it seems very likely at this point that we'll have more Ghost Trick content here. I find it a bit unfortunate that this was never brought up in the ~month that it was around, but oh well. How should we go about reacting to future GT:PD news? capefeather 00:47, May 19, 2010 (UTC)


 * The only crossover I've seen has been a dog called Missile. How about if anything else is revealed that it goes in a section called something like "References in other media" on its respective page? At least until it is confirmed whether or not they take place in the same universe. Strabo412 13:29, May 19, 2010 (UTC)


 * I've just found it odd that several people have treated this (or maybe something else?) as confirmation that they're in the same universe. I'm getting Perfect Prosecutor vibes. capefeather 15:06, May 19, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, let's be honest; people are odd. If nothing else I myself can't really see AA characters in the sort of art style GH characters are in...  Strabo412 00:48, May 26, 2010 (UTC)

Manga stuff
This message comes in response to the creation of the (probably) poorly named stub article "Phoenix Wright Manga". Now, I'm not exactly an expert on the manga, so I've largely avoided it. However, I have believed for a long time that the wiki should eventually have significant encyclopedic content about the manga. I guess the main problem is that there are multiple manga around that (I think?) are authorized, so it would be worthwhile to establish canon issues and such. capefeather 15:34, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Can't we...
Change the Featured Article to Lady von Whippenburg now? She's obviously going to win and it's almost the end of the month. -- Life Sentence  18:42, September 30, 2010 (UTC)


 * Something about making Phoenix Wright the first article to be featured for only one month doesn't sit right with me. Of course, the first couple of featured articles only lasted a week due to the lack of a schedule in place, but still. capefeather 02:45, October 1, 2010 (UTC)


 * My first impression is that nothing sits right with you, Mr. Feather. --LifeSentence 22:30, October 3, 2010 (UTC)

Honestly, you're not in much of a position to criticize me. You have yet to make any direct, meaningful contribution to this wiki. You have even deleted your talk page containing ways to do just that. What that tells me is that you do not intend to make any direct, meaningful contribution to this wiki in the future.

The featured article system is not some kind of popularity contest. A great article gets exposure for two months to set an example for similar articles. It's almost frightening that people don't understand this and keep picking character articles. capefeather 23:28, October 3, 2010 (UTC)